Curse

Xenomortis · Aug 09, 2009, 11:48 PM // 23:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life Bringing

Second, prot is terrible. The ONLY prot you should need in the larger majority of the game is prot spirit. Things like Aegis and SoA at weaker specs should be on something like an MM. Prot is useless because you'll spend more time and energy trying to prot the damage than you would just hitting Heal Party once and healing it all in one spell.

Yes, a 15 energy spell every few seconds to try and mop up the damage done by those elementalists on 5 of your party members is really effecient.
Not to mention your frontliners are feeling some hate and those three melee attackers have just decided you need to die.

Aegis is fine on a MM. I'd shove Prot Spirit on them too simply because they have the energy to keep it going around people.
You should have prots too. Whilst PS usually suffices in HM, something like Spirit Bond can really take pressure off an ally. Reversal of Fortune is an excellent small prot and spot heal.
But what you really don't need, is a bar filled with healing skills.

Life Bringing · Aug 10, 2009, 12:18 AM // 00:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

Yes, a 15 energy spell every few seconds to try and mop up the damage done by those elementalists on 5 of your party members is really effecient.
Not to mention your frontliners are feeling some hate and those three melee attackers have just decided you need to die.

Aegis is fine on a MM. I'd shove Prot Spirit on them too simply because they have the energy to keep it going around people.
You should have prots too. Whilst PS usually suffices in HM, something like Spirit Bond can really take pressure off an ally. Reversal of Fortune is an excellent small prot and spot heal.
But what you really don't need, is a bar filled with healing skills.

You have Heal party, Aegis, PwK, Life, Prot spirit etc, which covers the melee raping you and the eles pounding on you. You aren't going to be able to prot the 5 members of your party, and, if you could, it would be a hell of a lot more than 15 energy to do so. Foul feast, Mend Body and soul and the like covers frontliners just fine, and thats if you even HAVE frontliners. Unlike in pvp, frontliners aren't necessary, because you have 10+ frontliners in the from of minions(that, and melee hero/hench are absolutely terrible).

Maybe i should rephrase what i said. prot in itself is not terrible. Prot becomes terrible when you dedicate a whole character to protting, and little else. If you need more prots than what can be thrown onto an MM bar, you're doing something wrong.

Perfected Shadow · Aug 10, 2009, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Link6590

And why is there so much love for divine boon? Have you tried it yet? Especially with a ZB bar? 3 pips of energy with a -1 for every spell for 50+ extra health when you should be proting against dmg in the first place? I'd say epic fail but then i'd have to kill myself.

You didn't get the selfless spirit memo? And divine boon means you get an extra heal tagged onto your prots. It doesn't mean you won't be protting...

maxxfury · Aug 10, 2009, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xenomortis

But what you really don't need, is a bar filled with healing skills.

Exactly. Any more than 2 spot heals is a waste, due to cast times and cooldowns...you cant spam faster than the cool downs and after cast enable you to.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow

You didn't get the selfless spirit memo? And divine boon means you get an extra heal tagged onto your prots. It doesn't mean you won't be protting...

Yup a 100hp~ heal every cast. beats takin a skill that ONLY heals for 100 or so. as you get the prot effect too. making the target WAY harder to kill than one your just spike healing.

Link6590 · Aug 10, 2009, 01:28 AM // 01:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxxfury

Zb is a near 300hp heal and is basically free under selfless if under50%.

And the -1regen doesnt hurt at all with the extra cheap small prots, rof is a 100hp heal + the usual damage negation effect aswell.

Thats where your so wrong. If you waiting till 25% to heal (if your trying to maximize heals), then your party is better off mailing for a new monk via ebay. 170+hp is enough, divine boon is just your hinderance now. And you have another thing coming if you think you can spam RoF for heals like a ER healer. It just doesn't work out. Try it out yourself before you start theorycrafting.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfected Shadow

You didn't get the selfless spirit memo? And divine boon means you get an extra heal tagged onto your prots. It doesn't mean you won't be protting...

I had that on the bar, kept it up when ever possible. And it was one of the worst experiences not having enough energy to push up even the smallest dmg.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life Bringing

You have Heal party, Aegis, PwK, Life, Prot spirit etc, which covers the melee raping you and the eles pounding on you. You aren't going to be able to prot the 5 members of your party, and, if you could, it would be a hell of a lot more than 15 energy to do so. Foul feast, Mend Body and soul and the like covers frontliners just fine, and thats if you even HAVE frontliners. Unlike in pvp, frontliners aren't necessary, because you have 10+ frontliners in the from of minions(that, and melee hero/hench are absolutely terrible).

Maybe i should rephrase what i said. prot in itself is not terrible. Prot becomes terrible when you dedicate a whole character to protting, and little else. If you need more prots than what can be thrown onto an MM bar, you're doing something wrong.

Its actually a lot easier to prot 5 people then you think.... Btw... Why are you bringing Rt skills if your a monk?... no </3 divine favor

?

And who ever keeps wrapping their mouths on AP on a monk plz, plz, use a better elite instead and aegis only when you need to?

? (not to say AP is bad, why on a monk though...your supposed to be paying attention to your team's red bars, not the enemies...)

Life Bringing · Aug 10, 2009, 01:49 AM // 01:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Link6590

Its actually a lot easier to prot 5 people then you think.... Btw... Why are you bringing Rt skills if your a monk?... no </3 divine favor

?

99% of the time in general PvE, i run h/h, or with a partner. Because of this, there are necrits backing up healing, which leads to amazing resto heals. As for protting 5 people, you're either going to waste a lot of energy or thyre going to be short/weak prots that arent going to stop much damage

Quote:

And who ever keeps wrapping their mouths on AP on a monk plz, plz, use a better elite instead and aegis only when you need to?

? (not to say AP is bad, why on a monk though...your supposed to be paying attention to your team's red bars, not the enemies...)

AP is not only perma aegis, which helps considerably in longer fights, it's also instant recharge seed and energy management. If you run discord, it's fairly simple to throw an AP on something, let a hero provide the condition and blow it up without a second thought. However, thanks to the selfless spirit and divine boon buff, it may not be needed. Before the buff, AP was also used to get a perma divine/selfless spirit.

maxxfury · Aug 10, 2009, 01:56 AM // 01:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Link6590

Thats where your so wrong. If you waiting till 25% to heal (if your trying to maximize heals), then your party is better off mailing for a new monk via ebay. 170+hp is enough, divine boon is just your hinderance now. And you have another thing coming if you think you can spam RoF for heals like a ER healer. It just doesn't work out. Try it out yourself before you start theorycrafting.

I had that on the bar, kept it up when ever possible. And it was one of the worst experiences not having enough energy to push up even the smallest dmg.

And who ever keeps wrapping their mouths on AP on a monk plz, plz, use a better elite instead and aegis only when you need to?

? (not to say AP is bad, why on a monk though...your supposed to be paying attention to your team's red bars, not the enemies...)

I said its a STEP towards the ER infoozer style. not a replacment ect.

The boon assists in the REST of the bar too not just overpowering ZB, 100hp heal on all the prots. The basic bar pretty much has an open elite slot anyway, be it zb, ls, aof, rc, whatevers...not a big deal.

Selfless has a 100% upkeep now, and makes you spells cos 3e less, its a very different animal now. And boon only a -1 energy per cast. your 5e prots cos 3e WITH boon up. So not been able to handle the energy with that is ...well..frankly bad.

I dont watch bars i watch the field 90% of the time, glancing at bars so seeing what mob is been mushed is FAR from difficult :/ plus if you have someone calling, pressing T is not hard either. If a monk cant multi task a little its his/her fault not the bar.

And do people not run aegis chains on multiple party members? yup, pretty sure they do. perma 50% block its pretty win in heavy melee areas...

laksa and curry · Aug 10, 2009, 02:26 AM // 02:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life Bringing

Now you're just being retarded. Clearly if you're going to run Holy Haste, don't overkill on the enchants. As for monking, i monked plenty until i realized it was a waste, and started blowing shit up with a scythe. You didn't even get the optionals right btw, and, i admit, this was a bar from before selfless buff.

I didnt make that build up, it was quoted from what you posted. Re-read what your replies were.

Maybe I am a retard but I was trying very hard to make sense of what you posted in your 1st and 2nd reply.

You have a knack for reading in between the lines too my thread starting post was about after the 6/8 buffs.

Awex Mafyews · Aug 10, 2009, 04:17 AM // 04:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocobo1

This game is way past the time when you could bring what you want. When I started playing, people asked for other players to group with, and the only specifics that ever happened was profession.

Yes it's sad, but as we all know this game has some severe issues. It also doesn't help that 90% of the playerbase is terrible. This is why it is required to run the most mindless easy to work builds.

Amen to that. 90% of the playerbase couldn't tell their right from their left let alone tell a good build from a bad one. Unless a build appears under "great" on PvX most noobs won't like it and no doubt flame you in the process.

The problem your faced with is that SOME of the 10% left is filled with arrogant and self righteous individuals who are just down right horrible to play with.

So basically your better off playing with heroes and hench and playing with whatever build suits your playing style.

Jeydra · Aug 10, 2009, 07:30 AM // 07:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by laksa and curry

How do you just "hit heal party once and healing all in one spell". I would like to use such a build too and since u said UA>HB i presume you run heal party using UA as the elite. Maybe "prot is terrible" like u said. Please show me how a good monk bar looks.

Sample Monk bar:

12 +1 +1 Healing Prayers
10 + 1 Divine Favour
8 + 1 Protection Prayers

Healer's Boon
Patient Spirit
Dwayna's Kiss
Heal Party
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Cure Hex
Protective Spirit
Aegis

It's missing PvE skills etc, you could play around and fix that.

Unreal Havoc · Aug 10, 2009, 08:40 AM // 08:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by maxxfury

I said its a STEP towards the ER infoozer style. not a replacment ect.

The boon assists in the REST of the bar too not just overpowering ZB, 100hp heal on all the prots. The basic bar pretty much has an open elite slot anyway, be it zb, ls, aof, rc, whatevers...not a big deal.

Selfless has a 100% upkeep now, and makes you spells cos 3e less, its a very different animal now. And boon only a -1 energy per cast. your 5e prots cos 3e WITH boon up. So not been able to handle the energy with that is ...well..frankly bad.

I dont watch bars i watch the field 90% of the time, glancing at bars so seeing what mob is been mushed is FAR from difficult :/ plus if you have someone calling, pressing T is not hard either. If a monk cant multi task a little its his/her fault not the bar.

And do people not run aegis chains on multiple party members? yup, pretty sure they do. perma 50% block its pretty win in heavy melee areas...

I like the Divine Boon buff. It throws a new element to Monk prot/heal hybrids.

I run this myself, using Life Sheath as my main heal. I tested it and it worked pretty well for me. Some stuff can obviously be switched around depending on the area.

Divine Protection Monk

YunSooJin · Aug 10, 2009, 08:44 AM // 08:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Life Bringing

This is what i would consider a bare monk bar. Tbh, it doesnt really matter what i think works best, so elite spot is open for UA/HB/WoH. Dwayna's Kiss can be replaced for ethereal depending on your elite choice. Second optional can be PS, random pve skill, something like vig spirit, Holy Haste, w/e, depends on what heroes im running. Last two optionals are Power Drain/WNWN for heroes, or selfless/GoLE for players. I would personally never monk in general pve. You lose so much damage output by monking thats its ridiculous to even try. I ended up going mo/d and scything shit because i got tired of stuff not dying fast enough. Finally, necrits are hawt

NM is terrible.

Please stop posting. You're spreading misinformation and ignorance.

J I L T · Aug 11, 2009, 08:54 AM // 08:54

Protection is over looked simply because most people don't know what defense is outside of minion masters and imbagons. Most players don't even mess with their own classes defense, how many warriors do you see use a blocking stance? Rangers interrupt eles? Eles bring wards? Probably not a lot. This topic even proves it mms were endorsed more than protection prayers. Everytime an mm came up nothing but good things to say but any protection spells aside from protective spirit, aegis, a condition removal, spirit bond, shield of absorption and rebirth is iffy or just plain sucks and apparently that includes elites. And saying any monk elite is bad is ridiculous because they are all powerful yes even healer's covenant of course selfless spirit is better now but I stand by what I said.

But back to what the topic is actually about people have loled at me for using a protection build and one time I remember a hard mode mission I pinged my build which was boon protector build (this was way back when even before boon signet was changed which was my elite) and I was told that elite sucks and that zealous benediction was the best so that person who said it insisted on protecting. I said ok just to avoid a debate about it and when we actually started doing the mission the player who thought they were such a pro protector did almost nothing besides spam protective spirit. When I died he wanted to blame me for not kiting. I guess the point was more often than not people who refuse to accept any alternative to the current meta builds have no idea how to play that class.

And I'm not flaming anyone I honestly don't really care how anyone else plays the game it's just odd that with all the different skills, strategies and play styles that are at our fingertips so many people opt for cookie cutter builds. But I'm a devil's advocate so I just naturally go against the group.